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Topic: 88 Bird intermittent engine shut down***SOLVED (Read 9589 times) previous topic - next topic

Re: 88 Bird intermittent engine shut down

Reply #15
Just out of curiosity, what brand of ign switch did you replace the stocker with?
'84 Mustang
'98 Explorer 5.0
'03 Focus, dropped a valve seat. yay. freakin' split port engines...
'06 Explorer EB 4.6

Re: 88 Bird intermittent engine shut down

Reply #16
i replaced with another stock unit,, i believe mason got the ign sw & pigtail from LMR


Re: 88 Bird intermittent engine shut down

Reply #17
can we test drive the car without a spout installed>?


Re: 88 Bird intermittent engine shut down

Reply #19
Check the voltage at the Batt side of the coil:
1. With the key on.
2. With the engine running.
3. With engine running and the head lights on.
4. With the engine running and the headlights and any other electrical load you can think of. HVAC blower, rear window defogger, etc.

5. Next, turn the key off and unplug the TFI connector.
6. Turn the key on and check the voltage between the Batt and the Tach (one wire on the Batt, the other on the Tach) at the coil. Should be close to zero. A voltage here shows a current draw through the coil without the TFI involved.

Re: 88 Bird intermittent engine shut down

Reply #20
will do today..... thank you,,,, i know where you are going with this softtouch

Re: 88 Bird intermittent engine shut down

Reply #21
answer below to voltage reading request but i took it a step further
1st is from batt neg to coil battery,  2nd is from coil battery to chassis
i figured since we are at it, why not get this info as well.

1. With the key on.
12
12

2. With the engine running
13.8
13.9

3. With engine running and the head lights on.
low beam
13.8
13.8

hi-beam
13..8
13.8

4. With the engine running and the headlights and any other electrical load you can think of. HVAC blower, rear window defogger, etc.
all on
12.95
12.65

#5 & 6... sorry,, will get that later today or tomorrow morning, mason has to get on the road....

Re: 88 Bird intermittent engine shut down

Reply #22
mason just broke down in south western va

called for a tow,, he's about an hour from his house.... so maybe later i can update.

the car started to go into on of its random fits after an hour of back road hilly driving.
it just went dead and stayed dead, he coasted to a safe area and got off the road.

he got out and check the shrader valve for fuel,, got a pretty good spray.
he pulled the coil wire off the dizzy and pull all the slack towards the driver door and with the other hand turned the key,,, he seems to think there is no spark.

while waiting on a tow... the car cooled down a bit and he tried to start again and it started for about a couple seconds.
waited a little bit more and the car ran again just a smidge longer.


Re: 88 Bird intermittent engine shut down

Reply #23
update,, mason is home

when the tow truck got there he actually drove the the car upon the flatbed!!!!!!!!!!!!!
he got home,, all is well,, the car is running fine so he went off to see food at food lion and drove home.

first thing we notice is THE CLOCK lost power because its reset.

the area he was driving gave a temp reading of around 205,, lots of hills and such.

this computer came from Vinnietbird... and is a reman.

normally this issue happens more often with the air is colder outside.... but thats not the case today.

i wonder if this reman eec has a safety shut down ckt thats wearing out,,,,,, isnt there one on the eec for shutting down the car if excessive temps are reached?  this is a eec from an application of mass air.  not sure if those eec have such a safety shut down ckt.


Re: 88 Bird intermittent engine shut down

Reply #24
softtouch-- here is results to your remaining 2 questions
5. Next, turn the key off and unplug the TFI connector.
6. Turn the key on and check the voltage between the Batt and the Tach (one wire on the Batt, the other on the Tach) at the coil. Should be close to zero. A voltage here shows a current draw through the coil without the TFI involved.

results
0 volts measuring on the TFI from pin 4 to 5 with key on engine off
these two pins are tac and battery directly on the connector itself

We moved on and pulled codes
on demand codes are qty of one = 95
memory codes are qty two = 18 & 95  (this code 18 shown does play into your earlier curiosity).


we are currently setting up to focus on the fuel pump ground ckt which is an ORANGE WIRE under the passanger seat.
What i want to do is jumper around the fuel pump relay with the KOEO, jumping the yellow to pink//black. 
I will then have mason bang on the tank & wiggle test wring with the end game to discover if there is an intermittent somewhere.
once that is done, we will ground the tan/light green wire at the self test conn, then turn to KOEO and listen for continuous fuel pump running.  we will then bang around on wiring, tank and wherever else to try to create an intermittent.

we will back pedal over to the earlier comment about the Clock lost power during masons roadside breakdown.  i notice on the fuse panel, fuse 8 is apart of a separate dc busswork on the fuse panel..... lets call it dc buss #8 which consists of fuse 4,8,16 & 12.  this DC buss bypasses the ign switch and is a home run to fuse link E (bk/or).



Re: 88 Bird intermittent engine shut down

Reply #25
The EEC shouldn't shut the car off it if gets too hot. It has no way to so. Plus 205* is in the normal operating temperature range.
88 Thunderbird LX: 306, Edelbrock Performer heads, Comp 266HR cam, Edelbrock Performer RPM intake, bunch of other stuff.

Re: 88 Bird intermittent engine shut down

Reply #26
We are now getting closer to the issue but its still vague....
We started the car and it idles , we have no way to know how long it will idle if we let it do or even if it will eventually die.

What we do know is that with a cold motor if we add RPM at or over 3k,, the engine will cut out,, yet the pedal is still pushed in.
"think rev limiter!!!

we tested this again,, holding the pedal to around 3k,, and the rpm came up but then the engine tries to die but then recovers.
all this with our foot still holding the gas pedal in the same 3k rpm spot.


Re: 88 Bird intermittent engine shut down

Reply #27
since we know the car is now stalling out if you hold the pedal to around 3k,, we move to spark visual.  we check on spark and its bluish white.. so spark seems ok.

we grounded the tan/light green at the self test conn then went to koeo.
the fuel pump did not actually sound steady ,, you know the mechanical noises things can make if there is wear and tear.  the pump is older though,, like *a lot* older, at least 80k miles older.

With the FP running we wiggle tested & lightly banged on things in the trunk, on the bottom of the fuel tank, the EEC area, the starter relay area and under the pass seat.  fuel pump did not cut off.

we connected a test light to the fuel pump power wire Pink / Black.
we stated and it idles fine.
we push and hold the pedal and he engine responds but as we hold the pedal, the engine itself falls on its face.
the rpms go down on thier own and the engine tries to recover.
The test light remains on during the entire event of the engine falling on its face... so the EEC is referencing a good ground to the FP relay,, and the relay itself is staying energized.

this is starting to sound like a fuel pump ............... mason is going to run up to autohole to buy a presure tester.. its about time he owned one anyway.


Re: 88 Bird intermittent engine shut down

Reply #28
tested fuel pres sitting still.

lol.. like we can drive it!!


ok
FPR vac line disconnected and cap on end
start car= 40psi
rev to around 3k and engine cuts out and begins to stall but recovers ,, but.. Fuel tester remained at 40psi the whole time.

well now this really sucks.....


Re: 88 Bird intermittent engine shut down

Reply #29
removed belt
started car on battery only...................

Problem narrowed down.... Car runs as it should!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Issue number 1- we need to have a belt!!!

so... now we begin troubleshooting.