Fox T-Bird/Cougar Forums

Technical => Drivetrain Tech => Topic started by: Aerocoupe on February 15, 2017, 04:44:47 PM

Title: 83-86 Floor Shift Conversion - Possible?
Post by: Aerocoupe on February 15, 2017, 04:44:47 PM
I know you can do a floor shift conversion on the 87-88 cars but can this be done on the 83-86 models?  I am not wanting to do one but was curious what the options were for the 83-86 cars that were column shifted cars.  I cannot remember for the life of me if the Turbo Coupes in these years were even offered with an auto or not.
Title: 83-86 Floor Shift Conversion - Possible?
Post by: Haystack on February 15, 2017, 04:48:07 PM
Yup, console plate will swap with 85-88 cars, but the center radio stack is 83-84 only due to dash. 85-88 console does swap.
Title: 83-86 Floor Shift Conversion - Possible?
Post by: Aerocoupe on February 15, 2017, 04:51:37 PM
So basically the 85-88 cars had the option to come factory center console shift but the 83-84 cars did not?  If I am incorrect can you post up which cars did so a person would know were to look for parts?
Title: 83-86 Floor Shift Conversion - Possible?
Post by: Aerocoupe on February 15, 2017, 04:55:04 PM
Checked the Wiki and it appears the 83 TC's were manual only and the 84 TC's had the option of an automatic but no mention of console shift.
Title: 83-86 Floor Shift Conversion - Possible?
Post by: softtouch on February 15, 2017, 05:35:13 PM
The 84 Shop Manual lists the T5 and the C3 as the transmission options for the Turbo Coupe.
Looking at the pictures, looks the T5 is floor shift only.
Title: 83-86 Floor Shift Conversion - Possible?
Post by: EricCoolCats on February 15, 2017, 08:22:15 PM
At least for the Cougar, there was no floor shift option on non-XR7 cars (meaning V6 and V8) from 1983-86. That didn't happen until 1987 with, of all things, a seating option.

But for XR7 models there definitely was a floor shift for either the T-5 manual or C3 auto.

Guessing the same deal for the T-Bird also, or similar.
Title: 83-86 Floor Shift Conversion - Possible?
Post by: TurboCoupe50 on February 15, 2017, 08:30:49 PM
I have a floor shifter quadrant indicator for a '84 Cougar XR7 that is marked with conventional PRND21... I was gonna use it on my '87 AOD shifter as my trans had a mod to prevent trans from shifting above 2nd when in D position, just never got around to it... Maybe I'll use it with the Lentech trans I have now...
Title: 83-86 Floor Shift Conversion - Possible?
Post by: BCA on February 15, 2017, 08:44:04 PM
To expand on Eric's post, all Turbo Coupe's were full console cars regardless of being an automatic or manual and yes, the Wiki page is correct about '83 TC's being manual only the first year. Some other Thunderbird models got it as well such as the Sport and the Fila but although not too common in the wild, it was optional on most all T-Bird trim levels.
Title: 83-86 Floor Shift Conversion - Possible?
Post by: 85CougarCobra on February 15, 2017, 10:11:37 PM
I can't speak with certainty regarding the 83-84 cars, but my 85 was originally a column shifted V6 C3 auto and is now a floor shifted V8 AOD.  I believe the 83-86 center consoles are full length to the back seat (assuming that 83/84 is slightly different than 85/86 at the dash connection) and then the 87/88 center console is shorter in length and basically stops at the arm rest.  Even though I have an 85, I used the 87/88 vintage center console in my conversion.
Title: 83-86 Floor Shift Conversion - Possible?
Post by: EricCoolCats on February 15, 2017, 10:21:47 PM
1985 XR7 with auto floor shifter (C3):
(http://www.coolcats.net/modelyear/images/85xr7interior_cloth.jpg)


1985 XR7 with manual shifter (T-5):
(http://www.coolcats.net/modelyear/images/85xr7interior_leather01.jpg)
Title: 83-86 Floor Shift Conversion - Possible?
Post by: Aerocoupe on February 16, 2017, 09:57:02 AM
Good discussion here guys.  So with everything you guys have contributed above this is what I think a person with an 83-84 car can do if they what to convert to a floor shifted auto (correct me if I am wrong) for an AOD or 4R70W:

1) Already have or obtain an 83-84 full length center console (85-88 are shaped different where they intersect the dash of the car)
2) Obtain an 84 auto shifter console plate or an 85-88 auto shifter console plate (84 will match the 83-84 console better but the 85-88 will work)
3) Obtain a 6 detent auto floor shifter ether from an 84 car (I think these are pretty rare) which will have PRND21 or from an 85-88 car which will have PRN(D)D1.  You will not want to use the 87-88 Turbo Coupe auto floor shifter has seven detents PRND321.
4) Then follow this write up on Eric's site - http://www.coolcats.net/modifying/floorshift_aod.html (would this be the same if you were to use a 4R70W?)

Does that about get it?  I am not 100% on the 85-88 floor shifter having the PRN(D)D1 pattern as I am not sure about the 85 & 86 cars.  The only reason I asked is when I looked at Eric's site it didn't seem to catch the 83-84 owners that may want to do this.
Title: 83-86 Floor Shift Conversion - Possible?
Post by: CoogarXR on February 16, 2017, 10:09:01 AM
I think in 83-84 all cougars and birds had full-length consoles. So that much should already be done.
Title: 83-86 Floor Shift Conversion - Possible?
Post by: Aerocoupe on February 16, 2017, 10:39:24 AM
That makes sense as my car was a base model 5.0 AOD car with the only option being power door mirrors and it has a full length console.
Title: 83-86 Floor Shift Conversion - Possible?
Post by: EricCoolCats on February 16, 2017, 12:16:26 PM
Quote from: Aerocoupe;459290
1) Already have or obtain an 83-84 full length center console (85-88 are shaped different where they intersect the dash of the car)

As mentioned, all 1983-84 cars had a console already...easy enough.


Quote from: Aerocoupe;459290
2) Obtain an 84 auto shifter console plate or an 85-88 auto shifter console plate (84 will match the 83-84 console better but the 85-88 will work)

Yeah...good luck with that. ;)


Quote from: Aerocoupe;459290
3) Obtain a 6 detent auto floor shifter ether from an 84 car (I think these are pretty rare) which will have PRND21 or from an 85-88 car which will have PRN(D)D1.  You will not want to use the 87-88 Turbo Coupe auto floor shifter has seven detents PRND321.

At this point it's going to be a little easier to find an AOD floor shifter. The scarcity of C3 floor shifters is just mind-boggling. I did a little research last night and found that auto 1984 turbo XR7s supposedly had late availability, probably in 1984 itself (January through May-ish from what I can deduce). So yeah...that's a rare thing.


Quote from: Aerocoupe;459290
4) Then follow this write up on Eric's site - http://www.coolcats.net/modifying/floorshift_aod.html (would this be the same if you were to use a 4R70W?)

It should be the same AFAIK.


Quote from: Aerocoupe;459290
Does that about get it?  I am not 100% on the 85-88 floor shifter having the PRN(D)D1 pattern as I am not sure about the 85 & 86 cars.  The only reason I asked is when I looked at Eric's site it didn't seem to catch the 83-84 owners that may want to do this.

The only real reason I never mentioned 1983-84 owners is that the trim pieces are just a nightmare to find. The installation is exactly the same, it's just the finishing touches that are more difficult. I did see an NOS 1983-84 manual shifter cover panel a few months ago, but that's the first one--new or used--I've seen in a long time.
Title: 83-86 Floor Shift Conversion - Possible?
Post by: Aerocoupe on February 17, 2017, 09:13:16 AM
Would any years of the Lincoln Mark VII floor shifters work?  I know the center console is entirely different so the only thing that would work would be the shifter and possibly the cable?
Title: 83-86 Floor Shift Conversion - Possible?
Post by: TurboCoupe50 on February 17, 2017, 09:58:02 AM
Quote from: Aerocoupe;459299
Would any years of the Lincoln Mark VII floor shifters work?  I know the center console is entirely different so the only thing that would work would be the shifter and possibly the cable?
Nope from what I've seen entirely different... At least that applies to the '86 I had and a base Bird that came through here that had one cobbled in it without console...

AFAIK the C3 was used in all automatic TC/XR7 for '84-'86, '87-'88 T-coupe Birds got the A4LD...
Title: 83-86 Floor Shift Conversion - Possible?
Post by: Aerocoupe on February 17, 2017, 10:51:52 AM
And the obvious statement would be that all 83-88 auto cars other than the XR7 and TC would be AOD cars?
Title: 83-86 Floor Shift Conversion - Possible?
Post by: CoogarXR on February 17, 2017, 11:35:31 AM
Quote from: Aerocoupe;459303
And the obvious statement would be that all 83-88 auto cars other than the XR7 and TC would be AOD cars?

The early V6s had C5 transmissions. I don't know what year the AOD started being mated with the V6. But I doubt you'd find a V6-floorshifed car anyhow.
Title: 83-86 Floor Shift Conversion - Possible?
Post by: softtouch on February 17, 2017, 01:07:13 PM
From the 84 Shop Manual:
Title: 83-86 Floor Shift Conversion - Possible?
Post by: EricCoolCats on February 17, 2017, 03:11:36 PM
AFAIK there were no floor-shift V6 AOD cars until 1987.

The AOD was an option for the 3.8L V6 in 1986 for sure...I've found evidence that it was available in 1983 and possibly 1984. It could have probably been ordered at any time between 1983-86, unofficially. Might not have been a big deal to swap one out on the assembly line. The V6 and V8 cars had the same bolt pattern, and a V8 AOD and torque converter fit on the V6 with zero mods. There was a specific stall converter for the V6 which may have determined whether enough of them were made to offer as an option. But I wouldn't be shocked if V8 converters found their way into V6 AOD optioned cars.

The main transmission for early aero V6 Cougars/T-Birds was the C5; there's one in my '84. But it never had a floor shifter in a Fox Cougar/T-Bird. Sometimes I wish it did...you know, to wind out that 112hp all the way LOL.
Title: 83-86 Floor Shift Conversion - Possible?
Post by: TurboCoupe50 on February 17, 2017, 06:16:26 PM
IF a AOD was optioned for a 3.8 the engine & trans would have been mated and put in rotation probably days before the car came down the line... Chances they'd been swapping trannys on assembly line are zero & none...
Title: 83-86 Floor Shift Conversion - Possible?
Post by: thunderjet302 on February 17, 2017, 09:20:56 PM
I've seen 1 floor shift V6 car, an 87 Cougar LS. I pulled the full length console out of it for my Thunderbird.