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Thread: Mass Air added, hesitation off the line

  1. #21
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    @ jcassity.....Yes that pro-m mass air is for 24lb injectors. I had that whole set up(ported cobra, 24's) I sold you in my bird and it ran VERY well. The mass air was bought new and was only a couple tears old when i sold to you
    88 sport,TW heads, comp xe270hr, cobra u/Tmoss ported lower, 65 mm throttle body, under drives,smog delete,
    1.7 roller rockers, cai, k&n, bbk adj regulator, 76mm Pro-m,all MSD ign. MSD dist,18 base timing, 3g alt.1 5/8 ceramic headers, 255lph walbro, 2.5" h-pipe, flowmasters, silverfox valvebody, 3.73 gear,
    http://i216.photobucket.com/albums/c...d/DSCF0185.jpg ( RIP : ( )

  2. #22
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    Did you use the MAF with the stock airbox or a conical filter clamped to the end?

    Depending on which way the MAF is set up jcassity will have to run it the same way.

    This should resolve the issue.
    '88 Thunderbird LX: 306, Edelbrock Performer heads, Comp 266HR cam, Edelbrock Performer RPM intake, Edelbrock 70mm TB, 76mm C&L MAF, 30lb injectors, 2.5" exhaust, AOD with 2800 PI converter, 8.8 with 3.73 gears, 31 spline Traction-Lok, 31 spline Moser axles, 04 Cobra front arms, Maximum Motorsports extreme duty rear arms, subframes.
    '11 Focus, '12 Mustang 3.7, '17 Accord EX-L V6

  3. #23
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    It's possible to have the lag with a MAF that's correct for injectors and ECM, but wrong for application...

    When the MAF crapped the bed on the '95 4.6 Bird we had a few months I installed a stock one for '92 Stang, idled fine, crused fine but had the off idle stumble upon opening throttle... It eventually set a code, was so bad you'd swear it would die but never did, one from a similar year V6 Bird fixed it...






    My other rides (that actually do run & drive)

    1969 Fairlane Cobra 428CJ 4-Speed

    1972 Comet GT - 306 C4

  4. #24
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    If you're futzing around with calibrated MAF's, you are almost ALWAYS going to have a hesitation in a car with an automatic. The MAF is a load sensor. When you're using a calibrated MAF, you CAN get the fuel right, but it skews the load calc. In EECIV, load is not percent load by default, and is instead VE. Which means when your load is miscalculated, your spark advance is wrong. You're under advancing.
    Additionally, unless the A9P has a chip of any kind where the Injector lo and hi slopes, breakpoint, and voltage offsets are altered for 24# injectors, and the MAF transfer function for the Mark's MAF has been substituted, it's never going to be right. Beyond that, GT40 heads have different knock characteristics, so your spark base table need to be altered as well as the sea level table and the altitude table (if you aren't setup to disable them) or you're going to get spark knock; especially in high ambient temps.
    1988 Thunderbird 5.0
    GT40P, TFS-1, KB domes, 30#, MAF conversion, Explorer GT40 Upper/Lower, Smog delete, Wide Ratio AOD Mod, Unlocked Speedo, 3G Charging System Upgrade, Hi-Torque Mini Starter, 3.73 LSD, BBK 1 5/8 unequal headers, H-Pipe.

    88 Thunderbird/Cougar EVTM
    (Thanks to Trinom for hosting)

  5. #25
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    Another issue is the Ford EEC IV's were not designed to run on fuel with 10% ethanol. They only have about +/- 12.5% adaptive control and they max out fairly quick when folks add on the bolt-ons and then add in the lack luster fuel we have now. Anymore the best thing to do is get a tune or buy a tuner and get proficient with a wide band O2.

    http://www.veryuseful.com/mustang/te...InnerWorkings/

  6. #26
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    One of the first things I did about that in my tune is to set the adaptives for max LTFT (KAMRF) from .850-1.15 to .750-1.25 and gave the same range to my STFT (LAMSE). Makes the car a bit more forgiving of my fuel choices.
    1988 Thunderbird 5.0
    GT40P, TFS-1, KB domes, 30#, MAF conversion, Explorer GT40 Upper/Lower, Smog delete, Wide Ratio AOD Mod, Unlocked Speedo, 3G Charging System Upgrade, Hi-Torque Mini Starter, 3.73 LSD, BBK 1 5/8 unequal headers, H-Pipe.

    88 Thunderbird/Cougar EVTM
    (Thanks to Trinom for hosting)

  7. #27
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    I had this ran with a cone filter on the end inside the passenger fender well...
    88 sport,TW heads, comp xe270hr, cobra u/Tmoss ported lower, 65 mm throttle body, under drives,smog delete,
    1.7 roller rockers, cai, k&n, bbk adj regulator, 76mm Pro-m,all MSD ign. MSD dist,18 base timing, 3g alt.1 5/8 ceramic headers, 255lph walbro, 2.5" h-pipe, flowmasters, silverfox valvebody, 3.73 gear,
    http://i216.photobucket.com/albums/c...d/DSCF0185.jpg ( RIP : ( )

  8. #28
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    Yeah, that will make a HUGE difference in the way the MAF reads. The really serious outfits that provide calibrated MAFs will provide a different MAF sample tube for cars with open cone filters.
    1988 Thunderbird 5.0
    GT40P, TFS-1, KB domes, 30#, MAF conversion, Explorer GT40 Upper/Lower, Smog delete, Wide Ratio AOD Mod, Unlocked Speedo, 3G Charging System Upgrade, Hi-Torque Mini Starter, 3.73 LSD, BBK 1 5/8 unequal headers, H-Pipe.

    88 Thunderbird/Cougar EVTM
    (Thanks to Trinom for hosting)

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by flipnbird View Post
    I had this ran with a cone filter on the end inside the passenger fender well...
    With a bend in front like a cold air intake or with the filter clamped to the end of the MAF and the MAF and filter both in the fenderwell?
    Attached Images Attached Images
    '88 Thunderbird LX: 306, Edelbrock Performer heads, Comp 266HR cam, Edelbrock Performer RPM intake, Edelbrock 70mm TB, 76mm C&L MAF, 30lb injectors, 2.5" exhaust, AOD with 2800 PI converter, 8.8 with 3.73 gears, 31 spline Traction-Lok, 31 spline Moser axles, 04 Cobra front arms, Maximum Motorsports extreme duty rear arms, subframes.
    '11 Focus, '12 Mustang 3.7, '17 Accord EX-L V6

  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheFoeYouKnow View Post
    If you're futzing around with calibrated MAF's, you are almost ALWAYS going to have a hesitation in a car with an automatic. The MAF is a load sensor. When you're using a calibrated MAF, you CAN get the fuel right, but it skews the load calc. In EECIV, load is not percent load by default, and is instead VE. Which means when your load is miscalculated, your spark advance is wrong. You're under advancing.
    Additionally, unless the A9P has a chip of any kind where the Injector lo and hi slopes, breakpoint, and voltage offsets are altered for 24# injectors, and the MAF transfer function for the Mark's MAF has been substituted, it's never going to be right. Beyond that, GT40 heads have different knock characteristics, so your spark base table need to be altered as well as the sea level table and the altitude table (if you aren't setup to disable them) or you're going to get spark knock; especially in high ambient temps.
    You know oddly enough my car with 30lb FRPP redtop EV1 injectors and a 76mm C&L MAF calibrated for them runs great with no tune. No hesitation, no knocking, nothing. I run 16* base timing SPOUT out and 93 octane Shell gas. Runs just as good or better than my '12 Mustang or '17 Accord.

    Is it the best way? No but it gets me by. I plan on getting a better MAF and a tune next year (was going to do that this year but blew all my car money on body work ). I'm hoping it's worth the cost and I pick up a couple HP.
    '88 Thunderbird LX: 306, Edelbrock Performer heads, Comp 266HR cam, Edelbrock Performer RPM intake, Edelbrock 70mm TB, 76mm C&L MAF, 30lb injectors, 2.5" exhaust, AOD with 2800 PI converter, 8.8 with 3.73 gears, 31 spline Traction-Lok, 31 spline Moser axles, 04 Cobra front arms, Maximum Motorsports extreme duty rear arms, subframes.
    '11 Focus, '12 Mustang 3.7, '17 Accord EX-L V6

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