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Thread: EEC tuning with Moates QH.

  1. #11
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    The calibration isn't with the sensor, it's about tuning the sampling tube size to spoof the reading.
    1988 Thunderbird 5.0
    GT40P, TFS-1, KB domes, 30#, MAF conversion, Explorer GT40 Upper/Lower, Smog delete, Wide Ratio AOD Mod, Unlocked Speedo, 3G Charging System Upgrade, Hi-Torque Mini Starter, 3.73 LSD, BBK 1 5/8 unequal headers, H-Pipe.

    88 Thunderbird/Cougar EVTM
    (Thanks to Trinom for hosting)

  2. #12
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    I'm going to sound grumpy here. It's 2015, "calibrated" MAFs are un-needed relic of the past when consumers didn't have the ability to adjust parameters in their ECUs.

    A MAF is simply a sensor. You flow X kg/hr, and the sensor outputs Y voltage. Simple.

    Screwing up the sampling tube location to spoof readings to adjust for injector size is just dumb. It's quite easy to change injector size directly in the ECU binary.
    Last edited by JeremyB; 07-06-2015 at 01:57 PM.

  3. #13
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    I'm not advocating for calibrated MAFs, but that's what I could afford to deal with at the time. Now I'm trying to figure out how to straighten it out. Maybe I'll try to source a F1ZF sensor. Then I can install the stock calibration tube verify the correct MAF transfer, and try setting the slopes and offsets for my injectors.
    1988 Thunderbird 5.0
    GT40P, TFS-1, KB domes, 30#, MAF conversion, Explorer GT40 Upper/Lower, Smog delete, Wide Ratio AOD Mod, Unlocked Speedo, 3G Charging System Upgrade, Hi-Torque Mini Starter, 3.73 LSD, BBK 1 5/8 unequal headers, H-Pipe.

    88 Thunderbird/Cougar EVTM
    (Thanks to Trinom for hosting)

  4. #14
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    Foe,

    Just making sure that you understand what I am trying to communicate. The MAF housing and the MAF sensor (the electronics) need to be from the same car that you are utilizing the MAF transfer function for. The way I understand it is a person can put that F1ZF sensor in a variety of different MAF housings (different bore diameters and internal profiles) and the flow rate versus voltage output will be different thus requiring different transfer functions. Starting with a known meter and sensor like one from a 94/95 GT Mustang (70mm MAF) and dumping that transfer function into your tune along with the correct data for your injectors will get you in a better spot a lot quicker than mixing and matching housings with sensors. Again, this is just how I understand it to work from when I moved up to an 80mm MAF from a 2001 Mustang GT on my '93 Coupe with an A9L and switch chip. Took my tuner no more than ten minutes to change the tune for the MAF and new 42 lb/hr injectors and the car fired right up.

    Darren

  5. #15
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    This makes my brain hurt! It's like tuning a SD motor by using "calibrated" ACTs to make up for larger injectors!

    So, you have a 73mm C&L housing, and a 94/95 Mustang sensor. If I've got this right: You should be able to use the purple tube (099) and input the MAF curve from the '94-95 GT. Don't use the MAF curve from the A9P A9L (Although from Googling, they seem pretty close). Keep the injector size at 19 lbs, and scale the load% by (30/19) = 1.58 (or scale displacement) to make up for the fact that you're adjusting the MAF signal via the purple tube. When you use "calibrated" MAFs, you screw up the load tables since you're tricking the ECU into thinking it has less air coming in than it really does to make up for the larger injectors you're running.

    http://www.cnlperformance.com/Calibration-chart.php

    Edit: You stated the 19lb tube with 30 lb injector slopes, which should work - and not require modifying for incorrect load if you used the '94-95 GT MAF curve. Are you using the correct 19lb tube for the '94-'95 GT? (Gold [096])
    Last edited by JeremyB; 07-07-2015 at 07:10 PM.

  6. #16
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    If you want it to run right before you tune the car you need a F1VF sensor (89-93 5.0 Mustang sensor), the red 103 sample tube (you'll have to buy the equivalent tube from MAC), and you'll need a conical K&N filter RE0920. The 30lb calibration will NOT work with the stock air box or cold air kit. I've got a 76mm C&L MAF with a purple sample tube 099, K&N RE0920 filter, and 30lb red top FRPP injectors. My Thunderbird runs and drives like stock without any sort of tuner. Is it the right way to do it? No but it does work ok. At some point I plan on putting a 90mm Lightning MAF on the car and tuning it. I bet it will pick up a couple of HP with a tune over the calibrated MAF.

    If you need a F1VF sensor I do have a spare one that works fine. PM me if you can't find one locally.
    '88 Thunderbird LX: 306, Edelbrock Performer heads, Comp 266HR cam, Edelbrock Performer RPM intake, Edelbrock 70mm TB, 76mm C&L MAF, 30lb injectors, 2.5" exhaust, AOD with 2800 PI converter, 8.8 with 3.73 gears, 31 spline Traction-Lok, 31 spline Moser axles, 04 Cobra front arms, Maximum Motorsports extreme duty rear arms, subframes.
    '11 Focus, '12 Mustang 3.7, '17 Accord EX-L V6

  7. #17
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    I think I have the 19# tube for the F1ZF (MAC #101). I ordered a F1ZF (and for good measure a 55mm stock maf housing to put it in for baseline if necessary) on ebay yesterday. On the other hand, fiveologyracing provided me with the maf transfer table for the F2VF in the 73mm unit with the 19# tube today, they gave me a .xls with both the 19# table, and the difference between the 19 and 30 pound tubes, so I can do a little simple math and have the values for the 30# tube. We'll see how it goes over the next few days.
    1988 Thunderbird 5.0
    GT40P, TFS-1, KB domes, 30#, MAF conversion, Explorer GT40 Upper/Lower, Smog delete, Wide Ratio AOD Mod, Unlocked Speedo, 3G Charging System Upgrade, Hi-Torque Mini Starter, 3.73 LSD, BBK 1 5/8 unequal headers, H-Pipe.

    88 Thunderbird/Cougar EVTM
    (Thanks to Trinom for hosting)

  8. #18
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    What tubes do you have? The 101, 099, and 096?

  9. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by JeremyB View Post
    What tubes do you have? The 101, 099, and 096?
    I have 101 and 106. Right now, I'm running the 106, with the F2VF maf transfer, the 30lb breakpoints, and scaled displacement. Scaling the displacement smoothed the idle and radically improved the power curve and response. I don't know yet what the whole curve feels like, as my morning drive is through 6 miles of neighborhoods.
    1988 Thunderbird 5.0
    GT40P, TFS-1, KB domes, 30#, MAF conversion, Explorer GT40 Upper/Lower, Smog delete, Wide Ratio AOD Mod, Unlocked Speedo, 3G Charging System Upgrade, Hi-Torque Mini Starter, 3.73 LSD, BBK 1 5/8 unequal headers, H-Pipe.

    88 Thunderbird/Cougar EVTM
    (Thanks to Trinom for hosting)

  10. #20
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    What's the 106? Don't see it on C&L's site.

    Obviously, your setup is in the ballpark, even with the odd mix of bits.

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