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Thread: Water4Gas

  1. #1
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    Default Water4Gas

    Does anyone here have any experience with this company or any hydrogen based systems?

    I started to look into this a couple of years ago but life got busy and never really proceeded any further. To be honest, I had completely forgotten about hydrogen assistance for vehicles until I passed a Pepsi semi-truck with a hydrogen-powered sticker on the side of it.
    I managed to get a hold of the driver of the truck via CB and he said they had been running them for about a year and that it had improved his mileage by about 1.5 to 2 mpg (which is a huge improvement for commercial trucks that generally average 5 to 7 mpg).

    From my little bit of understanding you take a tank, water, baking powder, metal rods, and some electricity and convert the water to hydrogen. Then you introduce the hydrogen to the fuel system.

    If you google "water4gas" (they sell an ebook with all the information you need to make your own system, there is plenty of other companies that do the same thing. This is just the one that stuck out to me and that I have been receiving newsletters from for the past couple of years) their site will pop up along with lots of other information.

    Any feedback would be great!

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    Is that the thing they used on the Ebay Fox Tbird that got like 300 MPG?
    -'88 Tbird 3.8
    -2012 Altima 2.5 BASE.


    Future: Budget 5.0 300 HP.

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    Don't buy it. Electrolysis is a very energy intensive way to extract hydrogen from water. The very little bit of hydrogen that system would produce would not be enough to spin the alternator the extra amount it would need to provide the electricity for the electrolysis. Even if electrolysis were 100% efficient (IE you get exactly the amount of energy out that you put in) you'd only break even. And it isn't, not even close, so you won't. And that's not even counting the losses in converting mechanical energy into electrical energy to run the system...

    Now, that being said, IF (and that is a big "IF") you could somehow integrate the system into your vehicle so that it only uses waste energy to generate hydrogen, such as by making up some kind of regenerative braking system like hybrids use to recharge their batteries or by covering every horizontal surface with highly efficient solar cells to generate that power you MIGHT, and I repeat MIGHT get a slight improvement. The simple fact of it is that you would need to generate a tremendous amount of hydrogen to run an engine, even at idle. A single revolution of the engine would empty the hydrogen tank in the water4gas setup, and the setup could not possibly generate enough hydrogen to fuel the next revolution.
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    Using electrolysis is not an ALTERNATIVE to using gasoline. It is a SUPPLEMENT. I don't know why so many people think it's a replacement. Yes, as a replacement to gas only, it is impossible. It does take energy to make it, but since your alt makes extra energy anyway, why not use the leftovers to pull some of that hydrogen out?

    Speculation is what it is, and I will say no, I don't have any personal experience with it. BUT, I do know 2 people who each had a friend (yes, I know how it sounds) with big jacked up 4x4's back in the $4/gal gas crisis who homemade systems for about $100 and saw about 3-5 mpg increases. As a SUPPLEMENT to gas, not a full replacement.

    This subject has been beat to death in online forums all over, and there will always be people who will tell you it can't work and there will always be people who tell you it makes sense. I'm not saying I'm right, I'm not saying Thunder Chicken is wrong. I don't know, I've never done it. In the end it really comes down to doing it for yourself and finding out firsthand. If it was me I wouldn't buy one of those expensive kits though. Those are a waste of money either way. Build one yourself. It's relatively simple and you can find designs online.
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    Quote Originally Posted by sarjxxx View Post
    Using electrolysis is not an ALTERNATIVE to using gasoline. It is a SUPPLEMENT. I don't know why so many people think it's a replacement. Yes, as a replacement to gas only, it is impossible. It does take energy to make it, but since your alt makes extra energy anyway, why not use the leftovers to pull some of that hydrogen out
    I just wanted to emphasize the supplement part in case I didn't make that clear in my first post.

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    Quote Originally Posted by T-BirdX3 View Post
    I just wanted to emphasize the supplement part in case I didn't make that clear in my first post.
    Sorry that wasn't directed at you. In my "research" on the web in the past I've come across a lot of people who think that using hydrogen is a full replacement, and that's kinda the way TC was coming off as if he thought the same thing. It was just on my mind and I vented. I realized what you meant.
    --Steve
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    What really got my attention was that a company as large as Pepsi was using hydrogen to assist their petroleum powered truck and that the driver (who receives no benefit one way or the other said that he noticed an improvement in mpg). Yes, Pepsi could just be trying to look "green", but if going green increases mpg on ordinary vehicles, then I'm all for it.

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    Well, like I said, I've always "heard" that it's worth it. I wanted to try it a few years ago to, but like you, I didn't get around to it, and then when gas prices fell back down, I forgot all about it.

    If I drove a big gnarly truck, I'd probably have some sort of system in it. But for now, 18 mpg out of my tbird is something I can live with.
    --Steve
    1988 Cougar V6
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    2011 Mustang 3.7L

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    Red face

    Quote Originally Posted by sarjxxx View Post
    Sorry that wasn't directed at you. In my "research" on the web in the past I've come across a lot of people who think that using hydrogen is a full replacement, and that's kinda the way TC was coming off as if he thought the same thing. It was just on my mind and I vented. I realized what you meant.
    No problems! I know it wasn't aimed at me. I just wanted to make sure that everyone knew that I'm interested in using it to supplement my petroleum powered vehicles not in replacing my petroleum powered vehicles.

    So it is all good! Thanks for the quick replies. Keep them coming, I'm really hoping for someone on here to have had experience with this though!

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    I run the turbo 4 and usually get between 25 and 32. But I really like the idea of increasing the mpg on my dd without having to give up my beloved TC.

    The thought of a 32mpg+ T-Bird is very appealing to me! Especially when passing someone in a Prius. hehe

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